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startprobleem porsche 924 
Auteur Bericht
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Bericht startprobleem porsche 924
Hallo met Manu
Wie kan mij helpen met het op starten van mijn porsche 924 1979
Ben nieuw lid


08 aug 2018 14:55
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911 3.2 Carrera
Bericht Re: startprobleem porsche 924
Welkom, maar met zo’n vraagstelling kan niemand wat mee behalve: breng hem naar de garage en laat hem repareren.


Wat zijn de sympthonen..... :idea:
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early to bed early to rise makes a man healthy wealthy and wise


08 aug 2018 15:59
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981 GT4, 971 4S, 931, 924, 968 cab
Utrechtse Heuvelrug
Bericht Re: startprobleem porsche 924
Hallo met Johann

Doet íe het even niet, of doet íe het jaren lang al niet meer?
Draaid de motor rond?
Heb je vonk?
Heb je benzine (druk)

Geef eens wat meer info er lopen hier wel aardig 924 kennis rond.
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08 aug 2018 16:14
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PorscheForum Rookie
Bericht Re: startprobleem porsche 924
Met Manu
Bedankt om zo snel te reageren.
Ik heb de wagen al 18 jaar,8 jaar mee gereden en 10 jaar op stal gestaan.
Na het halen van de wagen.
Ondervond k dat de benzine pomp stuk was,andere geplaatst,maar helaas de oorzaak niet.
Als ik de luchtfilter er af haal,en ik help de klep van de injectie dan blijft die eventjes draaien.
De bougies krijgen geen benzine,maar zijn wel goed.


08 aug 2018 18:57
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997S C2 cabrio
Krimpenerwaard
Bericht Re: startprobleem porsche 924
Hallo met wilco911:-)


Klinkt als een brandstofprobleem...


10 aug 2018 17:30
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PorscheForum Rookie
Bericht Re: startprobleem porsche 924
Met Manu
Ikzelf zou zeggen,ja een brandstof probleem.
Ik heb alles nagekeken,ziet er voor mij in orde uit.
Kan mij iemand wat meer uitleg geven,wat ik nog kan doen?
Alvast bedankt.


10 aug 2018 22:10
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981 GT4, 971 4S, 931, 924, 968 cab
Utrechtse Heuvelrug
Bericht Re: startprobleem porsche 924
Hier heb je en handige lijstje. Niet alles is van toepasing op een ongeblazen 924, maar zeker handig

924RACR op http://www.924Board.org schreef:
I wrote this up for a friend who just got a 931 that is being resurrected, as he's new to 931's; figured it'd be a good addition to the section. So what follows is basically a list of how to take a non-running 931 and see about getting it started.

A few critical things to start with. First off, these are interference engines, not like the 924NA. On the plus side, they still use the same $8 timing belt, and you can still set the tension by hand, with the old quarter-twist method, but you will want to do those first thing when you're getting to resuscitating it. Consider also replacing the water pump while you're in there; easy to do, and they're inexpensive on these cars.

Next item will be the fuel system. First, expect the gas tank is full of nasty junk; drain and rinse completely. Also remove the fuel filter, blow out the lines with compressed air, and install a new fuel filter. Note that the correct fuel flow direction is to the REAR of the car. Most cars come to us with the filter installed backwards. I recommend removing the in-tank pump (36mm wrench or socket required) and cleaning it's intake screen off, not to mention that this is the best way to flush the rust out of the tank. It'd be a good time to check resistance on it, make sure it's not dead. You don't want to have to drain the tank a second time!

Refit the pumps, add a little gas not a lot, and see if you can get the pumps to work and make noise by jumping the fuel pump relay. But not too much noise, of course, or they're dying. Mainly that'd be the external one making noise and dying. Naturally, no noise, you'll want to check for power and ground - the pump grounds back inside the trunk between the taillights, if that's the problem - and resistance of the pump itself, in case it's dead. Fuse number, as I recall, is #1 or #2 on the aux fuse panel (small fuse block near the main fuse/relay board).

If you do have noise, then you can check and see if you've got fuel up top at the fuel distributor. Most likely, the fuel distributor and.or warm-up regulator may be dead, but at least at this point you can, if you're getting fuel up front, see if it's getting to and through the injectors. You should be able to hear a high-pitched whine if you have the fuel pump on, and push down on the air flow meter plate - that's the fuel going through the injectors. Don't do it too much, as you'll wash down the cylinder walls and fill the oil pan with fuel!

If you're not hearing that whine, your fuel distributor may be gummed up. You can check further by pulling an injector and seeing if it'll spray into a bottle when you lift up on the plate. If this is the case, you may be able to free the center metering plunger with a little compressed air injected into the top center port, but this doesn't always work. If not, you'll have to get a rebuilt one; currently the best deals going seem to be at http://www.SpecialTAuto.com, a Delorean specialist who also handles Porsche fuel injection bits; he's got prices for rebuilt Bosch CIS components far below anything else I've seen out there. I just received and installed a rebuild warm-up regulator (WUR) in my '81 931 from him, and it was perfect, flawless.

Once you've got fuel to the injectors, you will likely want to check that WUR, using the CIS pressure gauges, and make sure that you're both getting the proper fuel delivery pressure from the fuel pump (around 5-6bar), and that the WUR is throttling that back properly (to control pressure between 2-3 bar). Often the WUR fails in such a way that it doesn't regulate pressure, resulting in control pressure equal to fuel delivery pressure, which means improper mixture control - usually too lean, bad for an NA, and horrible for a turbo! Again, if a rebuild is needed, I recommend SpecialTAuto.

Once these are set, you can see about starting the car; at this point, I still recommend using the fuel pump relay jumper, as there are other things that can keep that from working (beyond the relay itself being NG) and you don't want to be distracted by those just yet - you just want to get the car running now. So crank it, see if it runs, see if you have a spark if needed. The 81-82 cars have a more complicated ignition system which can result in problems at this point; in my case, the 81 had an inop crank trigger sensor. Problems here usually show up on the tach when cranking, in that the needle swings wildly or doesn't move at all. Beyond that, the '79-80 Turbos are substantially different in the ignition system than the '81-82's, which are all I've messed with, so that'll be best left for another discussion.

So if you're getting fuel through the steps described above, and you've got spark, the car should basically be ready to start.

Next step will be going back and making sure the fuel pump relay works. Easiest thing to start with is dropping it back in once the car runs, and seeing if it'll restart. If not, check first for a ground on the relay. They ground with a small pin in the top corner; pull the relay board forward enough to see the wire colors, it'll be a small brown wire. This doesn't go to ground!

It grounds and turns the relay on with a switch in the intake duct near the throttle body; this switch kills fuel in case of overboost. Naturally, for safety's sake, they fail in the open position. The switch is easy to test with a multimeter, just see if it's got conductivity between the terminal and it's threads. If it doesn't, you can jumper a wire from that plug to ground, and see if the fuel pump relay works now - just to check your results. If that was the only problem, the relay should now work and the car should start. The switch is readily available from parts suppliers or the dealership, as it's now superseded to a 993 or 996 Turbo part.

If the switch is good, replaced, or jumpered around and still the relay won't work, you need to check the tach signal; the relay also uses an input from the coil to confirm that the engine's spinning in order to receive fuel (crash safety consideration. This circuit is as I recall the solid green wire, and also goes to the tach and the green wires at the top of the coil. So if the engine will run with the pump relay jumpered, but not with the relay in place (and the overboost switch is functional or bypassed), then see what the tach is doing. If it is jumping when the engine cranks or working with the engine running, clearly there's a break in the circuit (or a poor/corroded connection)... likewise, if it isn't working, neither the tach nor relay are functioning, clearly there's a break elsewhere in this circuit... time to break out the multimeter and check connections.

After all the above is checked out, the car should be able to run properly/normally. Next thing at the top of my list would be to check cooling function; first check that the fans can and do work. I'd want to know that they both kick on with ignition on and the rad fan switch jumpered; I'd also want to know that they both turn on when the AC is turned on (as they should). At very least, this will mean that I can manually turn on the fans during the next step - drive the car, warm it up, get it hot, and see if the fans come on automagically. If you don't hear them by the time the water temp clears the 3/4 mark, you'll want to turn the AC on and force the fans on to cool the engine.

Fan switches come in 3 different flavours, 75, 85, and 95C. I think turbos used as daily drivers should have the 75C switch, they generate so much heat. Mine seems to have the 95 in it right now, and by the time the fans kick on automatically, I usually already have turned the AC on to avoid the temp spike (usually after blasting down the highway then coming to a dead stop). BTW, AC retrofit to R134a is doable and useful, but that's a discussion for another day.

So at this point you get to evaluate the effectiveness of the cooling system; you'll be best off if you preemptively replace all the hoses and flush the system with a radiator flush product from the local parts store - the rad often gets gunked up. On refilling, use the phosphate-free/silicate-free orange stuff.

Finally, running condition... I won't get into tuning them, other than to point out that these cars, being CIS, HATE vacuum leaks; it's even worse with turbos than NAs. Furthermore, there are countless little elbows that degrade over time, generate cracks, and cause odd hot-vs-cold running problems and hesitation, stumbling off-boost. I replaced all mine, some I managed to hunt down stock OEM replacements for, but not all; however there are generic cut-to-fit 3/4" silicone hose elbows that cam be made to fit and do work well. Downside is they come in rather bright colors, for the ricer crowd. You also will need all new hose clamps, as the OD is slightly bigger than the stock elbows.

I got mine from Racer Parts Wholesale: http://www.racerpartswholesale.com/silhose3.htm (scroll down to the 90 degree bends, and you'll want the 3/4"/19mm... though some may be 16mm/0.625"). I don't remember just how many are required; it's something between 5-10. You will also want to save the straight sections, as there are a few straight vacuum hoses to be replaced as well. Note also that in addition to all the ones you can see, there's one that's well-hidden, took me a long time to find and fix (at which point, this being my last vacuum leak, the car magically got smooth and driveable). This connects from underneath the intake, on a port below the #1 runner at the front of the intake, wraps around with a hard line to the front of the engine, where there's another little elbow that plugs into the turbo for the compressor bypass valve. It's extremely difficult to get to, may require some disassembly. But it was worth it.

Hope that helps, this checklist and a lot of time should help get the car up and running.
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11 aug 2018 22:35
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